Ellen Fanning, Host: I spoke with the Assistant Federal Minister for Immigration Matt Thistlethwaite earlier.
Matt Thistlethwaite, Assistant Minister for Immigration: In Queensland, I had a look at the numbers, basically since the mid-1990s has had double the numbers of New Zealanders migrating to your state compared to the rest of the population. So, because people have family there, naturally there's an attraction to migrate to an area where you know people. So, I think that that in some respects compounds the numbers a bit each year. And secondly, I reckon if you lived in cold rainy New Zealand and you got to choose where you'd like to go in Australia, most people would say oh I want to go live in the sun and Queensland is the closest sunny state to New Zealand. The reason why New Zealanders get preference of entry into Australia is related to the closeness of the relationship. Obviously, they're our nearest and dearest neighbours, but also the fact that we have a free trade agreement with them that allows that migration pattern to Australia.
Fanning: It does seem odd, doesn't it, that you as the Assistant Minister for Immigration with Tony Burke, the Minister, you can dial down student numbers, you can dial down skilled visas, permanent migration, working holidaymakers. The one area you can't dial down is New Zealand citizens. All they have to do is buy a Jetstar ticket and organise someone to pick them up from the Gold Coast airport and they're here. Four years later, they're citizens.
Assistant Minister: Well, we can dial down the numbers in certain visa categories, and we do that. So, if they're applying for particular categories of visas in the skilled space, in the student space, then we can dial down those numbers. But you are right, there are relaxed conditions for New Zealanders that come to Australia on particular visas.
Fanning: Those numbers I was quoting were 444 visas which a New Zealander gets at the airport. They're not coming on skilled visas, they're all just turning up.
Assistant Minister: Yeah, that's correct. They do have a preference in terms of the access to Australia on those 444 visas. But we can work with the states and territories to adjust those numbers if we see fit in the future.
Fanning: Can you? How?
Assistant Minister: It appears that it's only an issue with Queensland, but we're happy to have a discussion with the Queensland Government if they feel that that there needs to be change there, and that's something that we could discuss with the New Zealand Government into the future, we can make adjustments. There's been no request from the Queensland government to make that adjustment, but we're constantly reviewing the way that the system works and working with those states and territories.
Fanning: The Federal Government is trying to drive down migration numbers. How much pressure do you come under from a state like Queensland to actually increase intakes to fill skills shortages?
Assistant Minister: Well, we have some large skill shortages in Australia, particularly in rural and regional areas. And whenever I meet with regional mayors and employers, they're crying out for more skilled labour. Most of the migration program to Australia is skilled migration. It makes up about two thirds of all of the numbers. And in terms of Queensland, over the last 12 months, there's been an increase by about 13% in skilled migrants.
Fanning: Do you have any idea why, in the first year of the Crisafulli Government, they put the brakes on the number of permanent migrants we settled in Queensland, taking in just 1,200. Then this financial year, they've said to the Commonwealth that they needed this big increase in permanent migrants to that 2500, so much so that the West Australians apparently are screaming at us because we took some of their allocation?
Assistant Minister: Yeah. It is confusing. And that's why I think it's important that the states and territories have a migration strategy and that they work with the Commonwealth on that. We can work with them, but we need to know what their plans are. And it was confusing that the Queensland Government initially wanted to cut numbers, now they want to boost them. I think that's particularly given the fact that the Olympics are coming up and some of the construction on those projects will start in the very short-term future. So, they're going to need those skills workers for those projects. So, we're ready to work with the Queensland Government, but I guess they need to sort out what they require in the various categories and develop a plan to work with us.
Fanning: Why did they do that? Why did they stomp the brakes so hard in their first year in office? Do you know?
Assistant Minister: I don't know. You'll have to ask the Queensland Government. I suspect it was to try to be populist. But once you get your feet behind the desk and you work out that you do require a large number of skilled visas and workers, particularly in rural and regional Queensland, to work in the aged care homes, to look after our elderly, to make sure that you've got adequate coverage in our hospitals, on night shifts in regions, to build the homes and the infrastructure of the future. These are all the majority of the migration program to Australia. And we want to work with the states and territories to make sure that they have the skills they need into the future.
Fanning: Because it was quite the turnaround in numbers that they asked the Federal Government for. In terms of the allocation, you've got to go to Canberra and say, this is how many we want. And they divided it up between the states. So, it was quite the difference from year one of the Crisafulli Government to year two. Do you know what it looks like? It looks like that they realised they couldn't staff the hospitals and aged care centres if they kept going the way they were. Would that be fair?
Assistant Minister: I think that's correct. They needed those extra skilled migrants. That's why they've made that request to the Commonwealth. We've responded with those increases in numbers for this year and we're awaiting the publication of the Jobs and Skills Australia list for this year. That's coming up soon and that will provide the foundation for our work with the states and territories on next year's numbers.
Fanning: Queensland, as you say, has such widespread labour shortages that your office tells me they're asking the Federal, the whole state to be covered by a Designated Area Migration Agreement just to make it easier to have more and more foreign workers come in.
Assistant Minister: So, Designated Area Migration Agreements, or DAMAs, are an agreement between a particular state or territory or a regional area with the Commonwealth Government to plan for skilled migration into those areas in the skills that are needed. And they range from low skilled occupations right up to professional occupations. There are two in Queensland. There's the Far North Queensland DAMA and the Townsville one. They both expire in April 27. And we've been working with the Queensland Government to do a statewide one because obviously there are skill shortages that exist beyond those two regions. We've found that the South Australian, WA and Northern Territory governments have recently negotiated statewide DAMAs, and they're working very well and they allow the Queensland Government to designate where they want skilled workers to go and what the skilled occupied in those regions are. So, we're negotiating that with them at the moment and looking forward to finalising that soon.
Fanning: What's the practical effect of that? Does it just make it easier for businesses to bring in foreign workers?
Assistant Minister: It means that there's a process for employers being able to apply for workers, but it also has requirements on employers regarding English language competency, the minimum payments and conditions that are provided, and the various skills that are required to work in that occupation and accreditation.
Fanning: So, if the Gold Coast Hospital needed more doctors, could they apply under the DAMA to get more doctors allowed into the Gold Coast? Similarly, if St. George needed more hospitality workers or cleaners, could they apply under the DAMA to allow more foreign workers in?
Assistant Minister: Yeah, that's correct. It provides that flexibility for those employers in that region.
Fanning: It sounds like the Queensland Government is saying we're going to need to bring in a whole lot more people to meet the skills deficit we have?
Assistant Minister: Well, it's not a free for all. It means that the Queensland Government would have to negotiate with the Department of Immigration based on the Jobs and Skills Australia skilled vacancy list. They need to demonstrate the shortages in particular occupations in particular regions. And that's why Jobs and Skills Australia do that work every year to work with employers. They undertake surveys, they look at job ads, they look at the needs of different regions, and they compile that list. The Queensland Government needs to demonstrate the need before they'll get the approval from the Commonwealth Department.
Fanning: Isn't that radically out of step with what the federal LNP are saying? They're coming with a new immigration policy calling for fewer migrants into Australia?
Assistant Minister: Well, the LNP are going to have to demonstrate which areas they're going to cut skilled migration in. They're saying they're going to cut migration by around 100,000. That was the policy that they took to the last election. Where are those skilled migrant cuts going to come? Which hospitals are going to have to close? Which aged care facilities won't have enough staff to look after their elderly residents? Which teachers jobs are going to be cut in rural and regional Queensland? What they're not saying is where those cuts are going to be made and when you've got massive school shortages, particularly in rural and regional areas, that's going to have a dramatic effect on those economies.
Fanning: Thank you so much for being so generous with your time.
Assistant Minister: Thanks, Ellen.