Interview with Jeremy Fernandez – Pacific Power – ABC News

Jeremy Fernandez: Australia's Minister for the Pacific, Zed Seselja, doesn't want an authoritarian regime in the Pacific's security environment, and he joins me now. Senator, welcome to the program.

Minister Seselja: Thanks, Jeremy.

Jeremy Fernandez: How concerned are you or, how suspicious are you, that there's more than meets the eye with China's intentions in the South Pacific?

Minister Seselja: Well, it is concerning and obviously, we've seen, I guess, a fairly aggressive posture from China in the region in recent times. We've seen that in South China Sea, and so obviously we want to see peace and prosperity here in Australia and indeed in our region. And so as we've engaged with the region, as we’ve engaged with China, that has been the message that we've had. We obviously are still willing to continue dialogue with China. That hasn't been where we would like it to be in recent times, and we're all aware of some of the reasons for that. But fundamentally, when we look to the Pacific, we look for their prosperity as well as the peace and prosperity and security of Australia and the region.

Jeremy Fernandez: The thing is, China has growing influence in the region, it’s not unforeseen. So does this amount to a diplomatic failure by Australia?

Minister Seselja: Well, no. In the end, sovereign nations will make sovereign decisions, but we have been engaging very strongly with the region, including the Solomon Islands. We have stepped up our engagement when it comes to, whether it's our aid budget, whether it's our people-to-people links, whether it is our security links, and in the Solomon Islands in particular, we have demonstrated just in the last few months just what a reliable partner we are. When Solomon Islands was facing difficulties with riots and unrest, it was Australia they turned to first and within 24 hours of that request, we had our AFP and ADF on the ground. They remain there, and I would say even in the context of this discussion around this draft agreement between Solomon Islands and the People's Republic of China, we have heard messages from the Solomon Islands’ Government making it very clear that Australia remains the partner of choice. Now, that does not mean that we don't have ongoing and remaining concerns. We are raising those concerns about this security agreement but in terms of the level of our effort, in terms of the way we have stepped up, the way we respond to disasters, to unrest or other issues in the region, we are the partner of choice and I think that is for good reason.

Jeremy Fernandez: And despite that, this is where we find ourselves. That's got to be a failure at some level, doesn't it?

Minister Seselja: Well, look, there will be those who will try and claim that that is the case. But when it comes to some of our political opponents in Australia who have said that, the Labor Party, they’ve said it's because of climate change, that is a complete misreading of the situation. They've said falsely, we've cut aid to the region. That is not the case. So those critics would have to say what exactly should have been done differently. So all of the efforts are there, they are continuing. Even in the midst of these discussions, the Solomon Islands’ Government has made it very clear that Australia remains the security partner of choice. We've not made that clear, we’ve raised these concerns, we’ve raised them respectfully. We're working with our partners in the region as well, and I think many of those concerns are shared in the region and, of course, there is a long way to go in these discussions.

Jeremy Fernandez: Are you taking this as a strategic wake-up call by Manasseh Sogavare?

Minister Seselja: Well, I mean, people can describe it however they would like. What I would say is we've been aware of the geostrategic competition in the region for some time. Our efforts in the Pacific predate any of that. But of course, they have stepped up considerably in recent years. And if you look at what we are doing right now in the region, delivering Guardian-class patrol boats, whether it's building the Western border outpost in the Solomons, we've agreed with the Eastern border outpost. The efforts that are there, from our aid budget, from people-to-people links to our military cooperation and our security cooperation, it is at the highest level it has ever been. Now, that's not to say that there are challenges, of course there are, and we're aware of those. But for some of those domestic critics, I would say, they haven't in any way indicated what they would do differently except to falsely claim cuts where there haven't been cuts, or to claim that somehow a country like Australia, which has reduced its emissions twice as fast as the average in the OECD, that somehow closer engagement between Solomon Islands and China, who have seen their emissions going up rapidly but somehow climate changes to blame, I think it's just a complete false diagnosis of the issue.

Jeremy Fernandez: How conceivable is it to you that this whole episode, all these developments, have brought forward the prospect of armed conflict on Australia's doorstep in the Pacific?

Minister Seselja: Well, I wouldn't be making those kind of assertions at all. We are concerned, but I think we shouldn't get ahead of ourselves. The Prime Minister of Solomon Islands has made it very clear there are no bases here. As I say, that doesn't take away our concerns about the possibility of this agreement and what it might mean. That's why we're making very strong representations in relation to it, but I wouldn't draw those kind of conclusions. All I would say is we live in challenging geostrategic times. It's one of the reasons we've invested so much in our defence capability. It is one of the reasons, they're not the only reason, why we've seen such a stepped up effort in our region by the Australian Government, and we are seeing significant degrees of success in that. Whether it is in our response to COVID and being the partner of choice in delivering doses right across our region, whether it is in our security arrangements, whether it is supporting humanitarian efforts in response to natural disasters, whether it is our climate financing, our efforts have stepped up in every area, but certainly it is a challenging geostrategic environment. As I say, it's one of the reasons we invest more and more in our defence capability, but also use all of the arms of government to make sure that we are investing in the peace and prosperity of our region.

Jeremy Fernandez: There is also concurrent speculation about American troops eventually being stationed at a new port to be built in Darwin Harbour. What would you say the prospects of that are?

Minster Seselja: Well that's a matter for the Defence Minister and others to comment on in detail. But I would say this, what we have seen in recent times is the cooperation with our alliance partner the United States has been very good, I think that is in our national interest. We as a Government have taken that relationship to a new level through AUKUS. This is something that no government has been able to achieve in decades, it is the most significant agreement since ANZUS. The level of our cooperation between Australia and the United States and our other allies is at the highest level it's ever been, certainly since World War II and when we've been involved in serious conflicts in the past, but in peacetime to have this kind of level of engagement, whether it's AUKUS which is very significant and indeed, in other fora, such as the Quad, we are stepping up with our partners, and that is very important. And I think that is being seen not just here in our region, but it's being seen around the world in terms of the leadership Scott Morrison has shown in landing those agreements.

Jeremy Fernandez: Would you say, though, that these developments have undermined the very premise of that AUKUS pact?

Minister Seselja: No. So sorry, which developments are you referring to?

Jeremy Fernandez: Well, these developments between you know this draft agreement between the Solomon Islands and China. There's growing influence that we're seeing on a number of fronts of China in the Pacific. Would you say that's undermined the AUKUS pact mission to provide a free and open South Pacific region?

Minister Seselja: No, not at all. I think it just highlights some of the challenges we're facing. I don't think anyone should be naive enough to think that there aren’t these challenges, that there aren't efforts by the Chinese Government in the region that has been apparent for many years. They are obviously a very significant power, they are a nation we have a positive trading relationship with, but of course we have a challenging relationship with at the moment, and that's been well documented. But if anything, these kinds of efforts simply highlight the need to be leaving no stone unturned, whether it is our direct engagement in the Pacific, whether it is our partnerships such as AUKUS, which do bring increased security for Australia through that kind of cooperation, or indeed, whether it is other multilateral engagements such as the Quad. I think this would simply highlight the need to leave no stone unturned, and that's what the Australian government's been doing.

Jeremy Fernandez: Do you think the Solomons can still be one over at this stage?

Minister Seselja: Well, discussions continue to take place, and what I would say is that when I've reached out to counterparts and colleagues in the region, they share many of the concerns that have been expressed by Australia and by New Zealand and others, and many of those discussions taking place and we are engaging very closely with the region. So one of the things I'll be doing this weekend is a number of leaders, number of senior representatives from Pacific Island nations will be coming into Australia, will be in Brisbane and we'll be having discussions around many issues, but including some of these shared concerns.

Jeremy Fernandez: Senator Zed Seselja, thank you for joining us.

Minister Seselja: It’s my pleasure. Thank you.